Electricity problem

[Bifferwine]

The Koralias are about 8 months old. I bought them when I set up this tank.

Fatman, my tank doesn't drop below 77 at night, except for the one or two times when I've accidentally left the window open. During the daytime, the highest it gets is 78, unless I forget to turn the fans on or something. It is such a large volume of water (300 gallons total) that it takes longer than your average tank to change temperatures.

The lowest it's ever gotten was when I accidentally left the window open this winter, and it got down to 67 overnight. Everything survived.

 

[Rcpilot]

Biff just unplug one item at a time until it stops shocking you.

This is where NoobdeBiff will come in handy. :mrgreen: He can take his hand in and out of the tank as you unplug powerheads, heaters, pumps, lights etc. Process of elimination.

 

[Bifferwine]

I checked stuff when NoobDeBiff got home. I didn't get a shock when I had the grounding probe in, and I took it out and didn't get a shock either, so it seems to be intermittent.

NoobDeBiff was going to ride his bike to work today so I could have the car to go to the hardware store to buy a voltmeter, but went he went outside, his bike had a flat. So I got up to drive him to work, and lo and behold, my car has a flat too. So I haven't been able to get to the hardware store yet.

 

[RyanG]

Do you think that the flat tires have anything to do with what happened to your little poochy a couple weeks ago?

 

[Bifferwine]

The bike tire, no. NDB got a flat when he was out for a ride about a week ago, and he fixed it with a patch, and it was the same tire that was flat today. Plus, we keep the bike next to the sliding glass doors on the back patio that is off of the master bedroom, so we would have seen someone do it to his bike.

My car, who knows. NDB got home from work around 3:30 am this morning, and I went to drive him to work at 8:00 am today, so there was only about a 4 hour window that someone could have done it in. So it's doubtful, but he said he didn't remember hitting anything or running over anything that could have taken a chunk out of the tire.

 

[Rcpilot]

On the volt meter:

Put the black/negative probe in the wall socket in the roundish ground part.

Put the red lead in the tank.

Put the Volt meter on 200V or 250V setting. Closest setting you have to 120V but at least 120V. >120

That will tell you voltage. Or current? Hell, I don't know. I'm no electrician. A reading is bad.

 

[Bifferwine]

Thanks! I just bought a voltmeter. Read through the instructions. Hell if I know if red or black is positive or negative, and of course the instructions don't say which is which. I guess that's just something I should know? As you all can tell, I'm a total moron with stuff like this. I just finished googling it and then I saw this!

Going to check right now.

 

[Bifferwine]

Okay, I just did some testing. And since I don't really know what I'm doing, I took pictures each step of the way:

I started the voltmeter off at the "AC V 250" setting, and it registered a little, so then I put it on the "AC V 50" setting (the next one down).

Here is a pic before I put the red end in the tank:

Then I put the red end in my tank:

Then unplugged things one by one. Not the powerheads. Not the return pump. Not either of the skimmer pumps.

Then I got to my refugium light and HOB filter on the sump for ChemiPure. Both of these were plugged into a white extension cord, which is then plugged into a powerstrip.

I unplugged the extension cord (which effectively unplugs both the light and filter) and got this:

Back to zero again.

Then I unplugged the two things from the extension cord, and when I did that, I got shocked and sparks and smoke started coming out of the holes in the extension cord. This is what the 3 pieces looked like:

So was this my problem all along, looks like some water got in the end of the extension cord where the two things plug in. Would this have caused the current in my tank?

 

[cgoodman381]

very easily could have caused it, get a new cord, then measure again.

 

[Bifferwine]

The plugs are all blackened. Is it still safe to use that filter and lights even though the plugs are black?

 

[cgoodman381]

clean them up as best you can, get all the salt and as much other stuff you can off of them. After then wipe them off completely with a paper towel and just make sure they are dry. Should be OK after that.

 

[RAYRAY]

wow !!! sorry for your loses Sarah !! Thank goodness you found the problem, it kinda looked close to being very dangerous !!! Not only for your animals but for yourself also !! Hope everything gets back on track for you !! keep your head up right!!

 

[Ironman]

hey biff, sorry I didnt catch this thread earlier to help. Yes just clean the ends as best you can with a wire brush, or a nail file if thats all you can get. Question, was this plug below the water level on the sump? and if so, did you have a drip loop in the cord rising above the water level in the sump? If it was just laying on the floor, and the cable from those filters came straight out of the sump and down to the plug they can actually start a syphon and drain very small amounts of water down the cord. which can complete a circuit in the tank to shock you. make sure you raise all electrical outlets as high as you can to avaid issues. all my outlets are mounted either on my canopy or at least above my sump. Looks like you have found the problem, I think that was reading 15 AC volts, which is pretty high. Usually you will get some stray voltage out of stuff no matter what but 15 is high. I have noticed that most mag drive pumps will put out some stray voltage no matter what. and as they get older it gets worse. so I accasionally check my stray voltage just to keep an eye on it. as for the grounding probe, if you have stray voltage in your tank a grounding probe is not a solution. But that said a grounding probe will nuetralize the voltage and cause less stress till you fix the problem. so I keep one in my tank and one in my sump. but you need to make an effort to every couple monthspull them out and check your tank for voltage again.

Sad to hear you lost some of your stuff, at least you have learned something though

 

[daugherty]

The other thing you can to is cut off the ends of the wires and by new plug ends at the hardware store. just an option.

 

[Rcpilot]

Buy a bigger extension cord. Didn't you say that you're running a refugium light and a filter of some type?

I'd get a heavy duty cord. Maybe not a big 10ga contractor grade cord--but I'd get a heavier cord than that. Probably cost ya $12 at the big box for a 15 foot 14ga extension cord.

Another thing you can do, would be to use GFCI power strips. Plug everything into the power strips and then plug the strips into the wall.

 

[jhnrb]

There are two schools of thought. one is to not ground the tank which completes the circuit and allows current to flow through the tank. the second is to use the ground probe to protect all. I personally agree with fatman and recommend for all to have ground probes in each area of water and electrical equipment. House hold current and water can kill under the right situations, so use the ground probe as a people protector. to isolate your problem, use an amp meter with probe in water and other probe in grounding spade of the outlet, start unplugging the pumps until the current stops. as fatman said the last item unplugged would the the culprit for sure. now start plugging the items back in but not the one that was last unplugged, and if no current shows up you are good to go and have isolated the problem, however, if you get current again as you plug items back in, the item plugged in when current appears is also part of the problem. keep repeating this procedure until no current shows up.

 

[simpleman]

I agree GCFI outlets are the way to go.

 

[fatman]

Yuor light and cords will be OK to use again once cleaned. Salt ions are very good conductors. I would literally sdubmerge as much of the cords as possible in a good sized container of water and clean them well thendry them off. Iron man is right about the drip loops, as the salt ware will stop at the loop and drip off rather than running all the way to the outlet. This salt creep usually happens over a very long period of time and salt is usually only apparent near the water source. A typical surge protector or even most ground fault circuit interrupters will not activate as you found out from stray voltage. Usually stray voltage is down in the mega-volt range not full volts and must be read with an digital meters as used in electronics and with new auto motive electriacl system computer components.

 

[dustin_P74]

i knew it. i told you you spilt water somewhere it wasnt supposed to be.

 

[Bifferwine]

Yeah when I get around to re-plugging that stuff in, I think I may nail the extension cord to the inside wall of the stand above the sump. Before it went around the base of the sump and out the back of the tank.

Well, not nail the cord itself, but you know what I mean. Support it with nails or something.