Help I Have a Green Mandarin in trouble!!!

[saboken_deleted]

I Posted this in another area about Disease but it may be the wrong place hope it's ok to post it here also I really need help with this one I don't want to loose the Green Mandarin "HELP!!!!!! I have had a Green Mandarin for about 3-4 months He has been eating fine from day one and after a week he readily took Mysis shrimp, I added A (Blue Dot Sea Hare), 4 more Astrea snails 8 total now and a Brittle Seastar, I acclimated them all for 2 hours and their all looking fine, but my Green Mandarin seems like it went Blind and lets me touch him pick him up I put him in a small container I use for acclimation and threw in some Mysis shrimp he did not touch them!!!! normally he goes nuts over them!!!! I have put him in the Refugium for now so I can keep an eye on him and find him if he dies! could the slug have poisoned him?? he was fine until I put these guys in and all the other fish are fine, or am I missing something a illness? I am at a loss here how a healthy fish could change so fast I change the water 10% a week the PH is 8,4 all the other stuff I test for are undetectable ammonia 0, nitrate 0, nitrite 0, the Phosphates 0, Calcium is 550ppm temp is 79F a bit warm but I can't afford a chiller and my Room A/C keeps it there at 79F also its a 75 Gal Cornerflo tank with a 20 Gal Sump/Refugium the Skimmer is in 24/7, I hope someone has a idea he was fine until I woke from a nap today he was all over the tank skimming the rocks for pods nonstop now he just sits there occasionally finding a corner and swimming into it.
" " Petco Was wrong again its not a Blue Dot Sea Hare I searched for hours and found it's a
Blunt-end Sea Hare - Dolabella auricularia
My Mandarin has regained some sight but is real skittish now I have no idea what is going on?????? " The Mandarin was fine till I put these extra clean up guys in and there was no sign of any Ink released by the Slug!! all I did before putting him in the Refugium was fill a filter bag with about 2 1/2 cups of Black Diamond Carbon placing it in the sump were there was a high flow just incase something was released into the water.

 

[saboken_deleted]

:^: I have no Idea what happened but He seems ok now he was a bit upset finding himself in the Refugium when his vision came back? I put him back in the display tank and he is acting normal again scanning the rocks for pods and took the mysis shrimp like normal? I am at a loss of what caused the temporary blindness? I was in a bit of panic because it was my Wife's favorite fish and I put a lot of time into getting him to eat prepared food whatever happened he was the only one affected! I thought the Lemon Peal Angel would be the one that could go blind since they have been know for this if they don't get the proper nutrition, but if anyone who has had Green Mandarin's that have experienced temporary blindness feel free to give me ideas of what could have happened there are no anemones in the tank and no poisonous fish the slug is nowhere to be found but I am sure it will come out sooner or later the seastar is holed up in a large pukani rock I say a tentacle reaching out for food this morning. is there anything I can test for that I have not yet? I will go get a kit for it ASAP I only have a API Marine kit plus a Phosphate and Calcium kit. I did say I was a intermediate reefer but now I am going change that to beginner I think I have just been lucky so far using my 25 year Cichlid experience, there is a light at the end of this situation my wife is going to happy to see he is ok since she is legally blind but can see bright colors with the help of a $1500.00 DLSR and 13x19 prints I make for her while she can still see a little, if she ever joins the forum please don't tell her I said anything she is very sensitive to her condition since it came on suddenly Thanks!

PS this site is full of the most helpful people and your advice is 99% dead on Thank you to everyone who has and will provide me help in the future it is appreciated more than I can say!!!!

Ken R

 

[chichimom79]

He was probably just in a daze after waking up?

 

[saboken_deleted]

I don't think so at night he is usually making his rounds grazing the rock that is when I saw him in the corner afraid to move I was able to pick him up by hand without a fight to put him in the Refugium but in the morning when I knew he could see catching him was a challenge he's not shy but hates nets or anything close to him like a algae magnet or scraper! there was definitely something wrong, I watched him for over 3 hours and he could not see he kept getting stuck or pressed up against a rock unless this is the first time he slept in 3 months? he was getting attacked by the Maroon Clown when he floated into his corner he usually avoids going into that corner, the only 2 fish that go in the clowns corner are the tang and yellow angel, I wish this was the case but I know him too well he was really blind for 6-8 hours. but thanks for the idea :D

 

[wontonflip]

Glad he's doing better now, though. I love mandarins. Next time, though, don't be quick to move him around, as it will just add more stress. But happy endings are great :)

 

[saboken_deleted]

I wanted to protect him from being picked on or eaten technically he was in the same tank just isolated so I did not think it was as bad as putting him in another tank with different parameters.

 

[ErinCahir]

Physically moving/touching fish is very stressful to them. We know you had good intentions, but there's no way to explain that to him.

 

[saboken_deleted]

I am a bit confused by L'extravagazna answer isn't the reason for isolating/quarantining not only new fish but also possibly sick, picked on, and fish that exhibit sudden behaviors not normal a good thing to prevent further issues and make it easier to observer them? I know anything can stress a fish but loosing his sight had to be extremely stressful since he was being attacked by the Maroon Clown when he drifted into it's lair and was unable to see to get away, correct me if I am wrong about how I handled this? Putting him in the Refugium were he was alone and the water was gentle I thought would be safe since it was the same water and if he did die I could find him, with out tearing my tank apart disrupting the whole tank hoping he was not in a cave, were I could not get to him risking a ammonia spike while he decayed. as I said I am still kind of new at this! and everyone here has helped a lot!!! just this time I am bit confused

 

[Mr.D]

Excessive touching and moving him around is stressful. Just leave him alone. Why did buy a sea hare? Also 79F is not warm by any means. Unless you have a cold water reef setup. I consistently keep my temp 83-84F. Knowing where your animals come from helps.

 

[ErinCahir]

+1 Mr.D

 

[saboken_deleted]

ok I'm out of here later going to find another forum I may me new but not stupid

 

[Mr.D]

If you misread my post any other than being. straight to the point, then you misread. Why leave because you were told something you didn't like? Look, you said you took the mandarin out, put him in a container. Then you said you put him in the refugium. That's more than enough handling. Sea hares do not typically do not do great in captivity. 6 months if you are lucky. You do not need a chiller for constant temp unless you live in the deserty areas of the US where the tank is at risk exceeding 90F.
There was no ill will in my previous post. Find your big boy pants.

 

[AnthonyTheNewbie]

Saboken, people here are only trying to help. Don't take everything to be a insult. They were just letting you know their opinions. Just say thank you, and continue your business as usual bud. The fish got better, so that's a good thing! :)

 

[saboken_deleted]

Ok I did find another forum but to clarify my issue here, I had a question about a concern for the Mandarin and all I got was don't touch him don't do this or that nothing about the fish in trouble and to answer MR.D I got the sea hare to control a algae outbreak every time I do a water change yes there is a lot of phosphates in my water and I can't afford a RO/DI unit just yet so the sea hare is a temporary solution to the water issue! I may keep him and supplement feed him or trade him but that is to be determined, so I have a happy tank now the steps I took worked and the tank is stable everyone is happy now, why did I get upset??? that should be obvious I was asking for help for the Mandarin not your stressing him!!! so thanks but no thanks I found a place were people read my posts beginning to end and answer the main question it was a pleasure but good bye!!!!!!!

 

[Mr.D]

Stop being a baby. You moved the fish more times than you really needed. The best thing to do when a fish is stressed is to just leave him alone. I read your post. 3 times. Why were you so convinced the fish went blind? To me it's a far stretch. Let me guess webmd told you he was? Part of the problem is the clown. They can and will heckle other fish to death. Extremely territorial.
As for the the ro/di unit, you don't NEED one. I get by with buying rodi h2o from my lfs. When their water isn't up to snuff, I get water from the culligan machines at WalMart. We get our drinking water from that anyways. It's 95-98% clean. Make sure you look at the maintenance records and buy just after they replace the filters. Frankly, don't know why I'm wasting my time replying to you.

 

[SarahSmile]

Mr. D. Please do not name call. There is a way to give advice without talking down to people. If you feel as though it is a waste of your time, do not give advice. Not everyone is going to like your advice, please do not take it personally.
Saboken, I'm sorry you got upset and we wish you all the best.

 

[Mr.D]

I don't take it personally. I get tired of whiners and cryers. There was nothing I said in my original post for him to run off like a baby. I'm calling it how I see it. Too less of you guys do that.

 

[saboken_deleted]

OK I am still waiting for the moderator to cancel my account but how do you move a fish from point A to point B? I catch them in a plastic container if possible avoiding a net then put the fish into point B the Refugium, it was not like I reached into the tank and grabbed! him with my bare hands! I try to keep them in the water at all times if possible! as for the blindness when I put a feeding stick in the tank and get within 1/2 a inch of the mandarin and he does not react he is either Blind or dying also while in the Refugium he kept getting caught under a lip for a optional Bio filter accessory un able to get around it! I have had him for 4-5 months now and know his behavior he swims away slowly when ever someone gets to close to the tank and when using a cleaning magnet, he was un able to see! I may be new with salt water but I have breed African Cichlids since 1992 so I think I have more than a basic understanding of fish just not all the details of a salt tank. so anyway a Ro unit is in my opinion a safer more convenient way to guarantee water quality as for my LFS they don't sell RO water, the closest LFS that does is a 100 miles round trip, I don't need to buy bottled water I have a 2 stage filter under my sink NO RO I use this water since it removes chlorine but from the tests it fails in removing phosphates! I have gravity fed water in my town stored in a 50+ year old tank god only knows what gets in there? so now that everyone knows all the un needed details! I have a method to my madness and yes I am pissed that I got every answer to my question but the one that should be most important!!! the fish!!!! this is not going to happen but some people would take the answers I got about leaving the fish alone as why bother having a second tank to isolate a sick fish it's better off dying in the display tank and there are no reasons to take precautions regardless of what it could kill if it died and could not be found! some people have 10-20 thousand dollars of fish and corals I know they wont leave a sick fish in their tank risking their investment. so I am done reading this nonsense I know there are people here that know were I am coming from and agree with me but having to write a book to explain myself was un needed! what is right for one is not right for another we all live in different parts of the US and world what is available to some is a luxury to me since I just can't get it here.

 

[ErinCahir]

We weren't saying "don't move the fish at all". Obviously sometimes it's necessary. What we WERE saying was don't move him too much. I was also under the impression from your OP that you did you use hands to scoop him up.

You didn't get a lot of response on your original question because it seemed the issue resolved itself, whether it was a temporary blindness issue caused by something in your tank or if it just took him a little longer than usual to wake up.

Good luck with your tank.

 

[chichimom79]

Saboken, from what I see, everyone has been giving you solid advice like we do for everyone else. I'm glad the mandarin is better and nobody except for you knows whether it was best to move him or not. We're just trying to help you. To get upset like you have is unnecessary. I wish you the best of luck with your tank whether or not you stick around. :happysun: