Adrastos
not getting a free ride
With a fish only tank you don't need to keep it that high... you can keep it around the 1.018 to 1.020 range with no worries for most species
HII new here and to salty fish
- Thread starter Massey
- Start date
just checked it again this morning (I stirred up the sand again before I went to bed last night) and the salinity is 1.023 and I cant see any salt on the sand nor the heatwave looking patters of the salt disolving like I could when I first put the salt in the water. I am going to be getting some rock here in a little while :) Thanks for all your help guys I really appreciate it.
Massey
Massey
Bifferwine
I am a girl
Okay, that sounds perfect. Good luck and keep us posted.
OK got 2 clowns :) They seem to like my tank they are playing in the currents of the pumps. Watching this makes me wonder if my pumps are too powerful. How can I tell? They are able to swim "upstream" but when they stop trying to go upstream they get pushed back kinda fast. I have a powerhead that is rated for 29-55 gallon tanks and that is the main pusher of my currents. My output for my canister filter (rated for 55 gallon tanks) is alot less than the powerhead. Should I turn the PH down some or ya all think this is OK. Oh and the PH is on the left side of the tank pushing at about a 30ish degree angle to the right of the tank, the filter out is about 45d going to the right as well.
Oh and I bought my fish a new light I got a Coralife, Lunar Aqualight. This thing really lights up my tank and makes everything inside look alot nicer. I need to get new timers now cause my old ones didnt have a grounding plug. Should I use both the blue and white lights or differ the times for them? I was planning on having the LEDs stay on at night but off durring the day.
Ok last question for now: As I build up my baserock and live rock should I keep them away from my heaters, or leave the heaters totally exposed? I have seen both at my LFS but I keep forgetting to ask some one there. I am currently using 2 submersable 150W heaters set for 79 Degrees F. My tank stays right about 79-80.
Massey
Oh and I bought my fish a new light I got a Coralife, Lunar Aqualight. This thing really lights up my tank and makes everything inside look alot nicer. I need to get new timers now cause my old ones didnt have a grounding plug. Should I use both the blue and white lights or differ the times for them? I was planning on having the LEDs stay on at night but off durring the day.
Ok last question for now: As I build up my baserock and live rock should I keep them away from my heaters, or leave the heaters totally exposed? I have seen both at my LFS but I keep forgetting to ask some one there. I am currently using 2 submersable 150W heaters set for 79 Degrees F. My tank stays right about 79-80.
Massey
Adrastos
not getting a free ride
Don't be too surprised when your fish die. Sorry to be hard on you here.. but you basically did the opposite of all the advice given to you.
Your tank needs to be cycled before adding fish. Unlike a freshwater tank, this takes more time. Actually, even a freshwater tank takes more time than you gave it.
So...Cross your fingers... most people don't use clowns as tank cyclers...
Your tank needs to be cycled before adding fish. Unlike a freshwater tank, this takes more time. Actually, even a freshwater tank takes more time than you gave it.
So...Cross your fingers... most people don't use clowns as tank cyclers...
Bifferwine
I am a girl
Hmmmm... Ad is mostly right. The fish may not survive. Depending on what kind of clowns you bought. Some are hardier than others.
The current is probably fine for them, a lot of current is good. If they can swim against it with no problem, I'd say it's not too strong.
For the lights are you talking about actinics and daylights? If this is what you mean, then yes, they stay on at the same time. If you want to mimic sunrise and sunset you can program the actinics (blue) to come on an hour before the daylights (white) and then have the actinics stay on for an hour after the daylights turn off.
You can hide the heaters behind the rocks if you want it to look better but it's a good idea to not let the heaters come into contact with the substrate or rocks. So if you can hide them without having the rocks touching them, that's fine.
Good luck. Keep us updated. Get ready for your new live rock and fish to start the cycle and check the water parameters regularly, you may have to remove the fish and take them back to the store if things get ugly ;).
The current is probably fine for them, a lot of current is good. If they can swim against it with no problem, I'd say it's not too strong.
For the lights are you talking about actinics and daylights? If this is what you mean, then yes, they stay on at the same time. If you want to mimic sunrise and sunset you can program the actinics (blue) to come on an hour before the daylights (white) and then have the actinics stay on for an hour after the daylights turn off.
You can hide the heaters behind the rocks if you want it to look better but it's a good idea to not let the heaters come into contact with the substrate or rocks. So if you can hide them without having the rocks touching them, that's fine.
Good luck. Keep us updated. Get ready for your new live rock and fish to start the cycle and check the water parameters regularly, you may have to remove the fish and take them back to the store if things get ugly ;).
I went with the Percula Clowns on the advise of my LFS. According to them these are hardy clowns that sould be good for starting the cycle on my tank. They did not have any live rock for me to purchase today but said they should have some by tuesday but that I should not get any until the weekend if I get the fish today. Either way according to them I would be OK. I dont really want my fish to die I am not here to kill fish. If I were I would get my pole and bait and head out to the Chessepeak bay and catch some for dinner.
Is the advise that they gave me ok, good bad or really ugly? The guy that I have been talking to has been pretty much right on the same page as you guys have been when asked the same questions. Another associate there said that this was also a good starter fish for a tank. These 2 have been the ones that have helped me set up this tank from the beginning and they know exactly what I have and have done and how long it has been since starting.
Should I wait till next weekend for the liverock or should I put some in the tank as soon as I can get some?
Massey
Is the advise that they gave me ok, good bad or really ugly? The guy that I have been talking to has been pretty much right on the same page as you guys have been when asked the same questions. Another associate there said that this was also a good starter fish for a tank. These 2 have been the ones that have helped me set up this tank from the beginning and they know exactly what I have and have done and how long it has been since starting.
Should I wait till next weekend for the liverock or should I put some in the tank as soon as I can get some?
Massey
Adrastos
not getting a free ride
Here you go.. try to read something.. here is a great article from about.com
10 Easy Aquarium Set Up Steps - Step 6: Let the Tank Cycle
here is a link to the full site:
10 Easy Aquarium Set Up Steps - Introduction
At this stage.. I'd ask yourself a simple question... how many of the steps listed did you do?
10 Easy Aquarium Set Up Steps - Step 6: Let the Tank Cycle
here is a link to the full site:
10 Easy Aquarium Set Up Steps - Introduction
At this stage.. I'd ask yourself a simple question... how many of the steps listed did you do?
Askin myself that question brings me to this:
I have completed steps 1-5 skipping step 4 because I am not using live rock, I may add some later I know I am going to have to wait on that one. I am now on step 6 letting the tank cycle. I did this by adding fish which the little guide says is one way to do this. Now what I choose for fish to start this cycle is not a damsel like the guide says I went here with the LFSs advise and bought clowns. So far I am doing what the guide says with the exception of the breed of fish.
Massey
I have completed steps 1-5 skipping step 4 because I am not using live rock, I may add some later I know I am going to have to wait on that one. I am now on step 6 letting the tank cycle. I did this by adding fish which the little guide says is one way to do this. Now what I choose for fish to start this cycle is not a damsel like the guide says I went here with the LFSs advise and bought clowns. So far I am doing what the guide says with the exception of the breed of fish.
Massey
Adrastos said:
No I didnt, I just didnt use live rock like I thought I was going to.
First off my books and my LFS both say I can start a cycle with fish, even the little guide you linked for me says that (thank you for the guide).
Secondly how in the world do you know how long I cycled my freshwater tanks? I have never posted anything about them here other than I have had them on and off for over 10 years (closer to 20 years now but about 10 years total uptime on tanks). I have had alot of success with my freshwater tanks and have had fish that have lived for many years in my tanks.
Yes I am crossing my fingers and hoping the LFS did not give me bad advise here.
I dont think that I know everything about fresh or salt water tanks, that is why I come here and ask questions for helpful people to answer and help me out here. I know that everyone here has their own prefered method of cycling a tank and setting up their stuff, does that mean your method is the only way? (no) Does that mean that I am wrong in what advise I followed (maybe but only time will tell) and does that mean that there are no better ways? (If not then why are there new products offered all the time?) Being new to saltwater I am asking questions here and at my LFS and getting about the same answers on everything asked. So why should I not follow the advise given to me? Or is is written some where in stone that I have to do things only one way?
Massey
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Adrastos
not getting a free ride
You can definitely cycle a tank with fish.. thats what they are there for.
All I said was not to be surprised if something happens to the clowns.. they are expensive cyclers. Most people like damsels because they are cheap. They are the goldfish of the saltwater world. The other problem with clowns is how old are they? Two males in a 30 gallon could be trouble.
Questions:
How long has your tank been filled? How long has salt been in it? How long has the salinity been constant? How long have you had a stable environment to add the fish?
The biggest problem most people have with saltwater tanks is rushing into them.
All I said was not to be surprised if something happens to the clowns.. they are expensive cyclers. Most people like damsels because they are cheap. They are the goldfish of the saltwater world. The other problem with clowns is how old are they? Two males in a 30 gallon could be trouble.
Questions:
How long has your tank been filled? How long has salt been in it? How long has the salinity been constant? How long have you had a stable environment to add the fish?
The biggest problem most people have with saltwater tanks is rushing into them.
The temp has been stable for 48 hours, Salt has been in for about 48 hours salinity has been stable at 1.023 for over 24hours now and the tank has been filled for about 72 hours ish. The fish are less than one year old but the LFS didnt have an exact age, they had these fish for about a month now. They are about 1 1/2 inches long and one is slightly bigger than the other, they were tankmates at the store and they are not fighting here, they are swimming together and playing in the currents. The bigger one was a little more agressive when I fed them but didnt keep the other from getting any food. They will follow me when I walk by the tank and also seem to "show off" a little when they notice that I am watching them.
Massey
Massey
bobby
I like to do bad things.
The reason your lfs sold you clowns for a cycle is because they cost more than damsels. There is a good chance they will die atleast one anyway. Damsels and chromis are your best bet for cycling. If you can I would take the clowns back and get store credit go with two green chromis there hardy like damsels, cheap like damsels and not nearly as aggresive as damsels. Just mt 0.2 cents though. Then after the cycle you can get the clowns and with proper husbandry they will be fine. Good luck and keep us posted.
P.S. Dont belive everything the lfs says not all but most are just in it for the sale, they dont care if the fish dies because there are almost always no return on hurt sick or dead fish. Before you buy anyhting do research on the animal and post on here what you want and someone will help the bedt advise we can give. Well again good luck.
P.S. Dont belive everything the lfs says not all but most are just in it for the sale, they dont care if the fish dies because there are almost always no return on hurt sick or dead fish. Before you buy anyhting do research on the animal and post on here what you want and someone will help the bedt advise we can give. Well again good luck.
Bifferwine
I am a girl
You can add all the live rock right away, but then you would run the risk of overloading your tank too quickly and your fish would probably die because the tank has not cycled yet and the live rock would likely induce a big cycle. You can add the live rock a little at a time, and this would probably result in several minicycles, also stressful to the fish, but probably not as bad as adding it all at once to an uncycled tank. Either way, it's up to you. I'd say your best option is to take the fish back and cycle using live rock when the store gets some in stock. This way you don't put the lives of your fish at risk.
reeffreak
Reef pro
I always cycled my tank with Clarkii(Sebae)clownfish and never had a problem.They are in my opinion just as hardy as the damsels.Here in Tn. they are $10.00 vs $4.00-$8.00 for damsels....hardly that more expensive.Don't forget most clowns are aquacultured making them more hardy than the wild caught ones,so I think you should be fine.
My 2 cents worth.
My 2 cents worth.
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Bifferwine
I am a girl
Yeah but a pair of Percs makes for quite an expensive tank cycler...
OK Met the store manager today and told her what was going on between here and there. SHe put me in touch with another fish guy that she claimed was the best one on her staff. I told him about the other associate giving me the advise on the clowns and his reply was that the damsles are better for breaking in a tank but I could with the clowns. I will have to watch my water chemistry a little closer. They just got their order of live rock in and also said that I could add some so long as the rock I picked out smelled like "Fresh Ocean" and not like "Rotten Fish". I bought about 11 LBS ( all I can afford right now) of Fresh smelling rock. He also told me to keep a good eye on the fish and if they are breathing heavy and not after playing hard, or their color starts looking wrong to put them in a bowl and bring them in and they will put them in a cycled tank for me till my tank is up and good (for a fee of course). So that is were my tank stands now.
Now to the Adventure of Marlin (now named Lucky) and Coral. These fish love my tanks currents and were playing in them most of the night. After I turned the lights off they started to explore my rocks and the castle that is in there too. In the morning when I came down to turn the lights on they were on the sand sleeping (slightly wiggling thier tails) with Marlin in the castle and Coral just outside. I went up and took a shower and when I came back down I could not find Marlin anywhere in the tank :eek: My heart sank I knew where he was and I knew this was bad. I turned the power off of everything and looked inside the intake of my powerhead and sure enough he was stuck indside. I guess he was too sleepy when he swam by it, he was swimming around the intake alot the night before and never got trapped. Well I pushed him off and the little guy swam away. He was defidently hurt and not himself but he was trying to swim and when I put some food infront of him he did eat so I though that he may make it. I dress my son and get him ready to go and when that was done I found Marlin inside the castle again laying on his side in the sand :( I took him out of the tank and placed him in a small glass container and put him near the tanks light to keep the water temp up. I didnt want him to die and cause an amonia spike while I was at work. Well I got off work early and when I came home Marlin was swimming around the little bowl and seemed that nothing was wrong (other than the small space) I floated him for a while in the tank to equalize the temps ( only off by about 5 degrees). :) When place in the tank again he acted like he was 100% again and started playing in the currents with Coral. I then decided to name him Lucky instead of Marlin. Soon as I got home I went to the LFS (as you know from above) and bought a filter for the powerhead to keep it from sucking up my fish.
All the power heads at both the stores I visit dont have any diffuser or filter on the powerheads so I didnt think that I would need one too. I was wrong and thankfully I got lucky.
Massey
Now to the Adventure of Marlin (now named Lucky) and Coral. These fish love my tanks currents and were playing in them most of the night. After I turned the lights off they started to explore my rocks and the castle that is in there too. In the morning when I came down to turn the lights on they were on the sand sleeping (slightly wiggling thier tails) with Marlin in the castle and Coral just outside. I went up and took a shower and when I came back down I could not find Marlin anywhere in the tank :eek: My heart sank I knew where he was and I knew this was bad. I turned the power off of everything and looked inside the intake of my powerhead and sure enough he was stuck indside. I guess he was too sleepy when he swam by it, he was swimming around the intake alot the night before and never got trapped. Well I pushed him off and the little guy swam away. He was defidently hurt and not himself but he was trying to swim and when I put some food infront of him he did eat so I though that he may make it. I dress my son and get him ready to go and when that was done I found Marlin inside the castle again laying on his side in the sand :( I took him out of the tank and placed him in a small glass container and put him near the tanks light to keep the water temp up. I didnt want him to die and cause an amonia spike while I was at work. Well I got off work early and when I came home Marlin was swimming around the little bowl and seemed that nothing was wrong (other than the small space) I floated him for a while in the tank to equalize the temps ( only off by about 5 degrees). :) When place in the tank again he acted like he was 100% again and started playing in the currents with Coral. I then decided to name him Lucky instead of Marlin. Soon as I got home I went to the LFS (as you know from above) and bought a filter for the powerhead to keep it from sucking up my fish.
All the power heads at both the stores I visit dont have any diffuser or filter on the powerheads so I didnt think that I would need one too. I was wrong and thankfully I got lucky.
Massey
Bifferwine
I am a girl
Good to hear your fish made it -- you're not the only one on here that has had fish accidentally sucked up by powerheads!
Yes, clowns are hardy and can be used to cycle tanks, but I think the point that others were trying to make is that you got some of the more expensive (and not the hardiest) of clown types.
Even though you bought some nicer smelling live rock, there may still be some die off. In that case, you are right -- just watch your water parameters.
5 degrees within a few hours is a pretty large temperature swing, especially for a fish that's already stressed. In the future, it might be a good idea to buy a small heater so that if you need to quarantine a fish again the temperature stays more stable. Keeping the temperature within 2 or 3 degrees over a 24 hour period is what you should aim for.
Sounds like you are doing well though, let us know what happens.
Yes, clowns are hardy and can be used to cycle tanks, but I think the point that others were trying to make is that you got some of the more expensive (and not the hardiest) of clown types.
Even though you bought some nicer smelling live rock, there may still be some die off. In that case, you are right -- just watch your water parameters.
5 degrees within a few hours is a pretty large temperature swing, especially for a fish that's already stressed. In the future, it might be a good idea to buy a small heater so that if you need to quarantine a fish again the temperature stays more stable. Keeping the temperature within 2 or 3 degrees over a 24 hour period is what you should aim for.
Sounds like you are doing well though, let us know what happens.
I didnt think that 5 degrees was too much considering the size of the bowl ( this was a pudding bowl that holds about 2 cups) I am going to be getting a small 2 1/2 gallon tank just for quarentine. I can fit a small heater and filter on that. I may go with a 5 gallon tho I have not made up my mind yet.
Massey
Massey
Bifferwine
I am a girl
I meant that 5 degrees in a matter of hours would be difficult for a stressed fish, no matter what size container it's in. It could be in a 200 gallon tank but large temperature swings like that still wouldn't be good for it. Sorry for the confusion.
