immigraton laws

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Forum' started by daugherty, Apr 28, 2010.

  1. daugherty

    Bifferwine I am a girl

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    Well duh because they are here illegally. Of course they will get arrested a lot -- they are arrested if they are identified or found!

    About 45 percent of all offenses were drug or immigration offenses.

    I'm betting that if you remove the immigration offense arrests (which make up nearly half of the arrests), the arrest rates for VIOLENT CRIMES of illegal immigrants would be similar to the arrest rates for violent crimes of US citizens.

    I'm not saying that illegal immigrants don't get arrested or commit crimes. I have lived in Arizona for 10 years now. The three violent/property crimes that have impacted me and my family have all been perpetrated by white people. I am no more likely to be fearful of a Hispanic person that I am a white person.

    What I am saying is that the governor's assertion that the illegal immigrants are responsible for rampant crime in Arizona is untrue. One of the main impetus behind this bill was to curb crime and the statistics just don't support that assertion.

    The ecomonic impacts of illegal immigrants are more devastating than the criminal impacts, IMO.
     
    Bifferwine, Apr 30, 2010
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  2. daugherty

    LBFish

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    Perhaps, but the point was only that statistics are not always all that informative depending on which hands they are in. There are similar statistics that indicate that there are a disproportionate number of illegal immigrants in US prisons.

    And actually, most of the time they get caught here the don't actually get arrested or deported. They get sent back to Mexico via a Voluntary Return. Someone has to rack up a lot of VR's before they will actually put them in jail and initiate deportation. Of course the new rules of ICE may have changed this a bit, it's been a couple years since i've had close contact with the procedure.

    You are actually more likely to be the victim of a crime committed by someone of your own race. Apparently those they like to commit crimes generally like to keep it in their own race...


    Without question you are right there, AZ likely wouldn't be bankrupt right now if it wasn't for the cost of illegal immigrants, CA too for that matter.
     
    LBFish, Apr 30, 2010
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  3. daugherty

    Bifferwine I am a girl

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    You know, I actually agree with everything you just said! :h5:
     
    Bifferwine, May 1, 2010
  4. daugherty

    VAreef

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    Ok I saw this thread rise to the top again so will add this. While reading the news today I saw that the proposed legislation for immigration reform will include biometric national ID cards for anyone who wants a job. Then suddenly that article disapeared and I couldn't find it again. A few minutes later there was an article about Obama killing immigration reform for this year.
     
    VAreef, May 1, 2010
  5. daugherty

    Bifferwine I am a girl

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    I haven't heard anything about national ID cards. He said he doesn't think he has enough support to get anything passed. But the 2010 budget does include more money for immigration:

    $70 million to hire 350 new agents and investigators in the Homeland Security Department to work with counterparts in Mexico on stemming the flow of drugs and guns across the border.

    The Immigration and Customs Enforcement division would see an additional $200 million to crack down on illegal immigrants, while Border Patrol is slated for $50 million to hire more border and customs officers.

    Some $112 million would boost the E-Verify program used by employers to check the immigration status of workers.
     
    Bifferwine, May 1, 2010
  6. daugherty

    VAreef

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    Like I said it disappeared from yahoo. Very weird. Don't matter now though since he now has said it's a dead issue.
     
    VAreef, May 1, 2010
  7. daugherty

    Bifferwine I am a girl

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    I think the idea of having a biometric national ID card would go over like a lead balloon!
     
    Bifferwine, May 1, 2010
  8. daugherty

    VAreef

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    Yeah no kidding or more accuratly lead bullet
     
    VAreef, May 1, 2010
  9. daugherty

    PRC Stop Quoting Me!

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    I've avoided this thread for 2 days...I can clear up the immigration problem in an afternoon.

    If you don't want illegal immigrants in the country simply stop hiring them...If your company is caught with illegal immigrants in your employ you should be handed a hefty fine...and when I say hefty I mean crippling..You've got to hit them with a fine so big that they can't consider it "cost of doing business"..

    If they can't work anywhere, they will have no choice but to go back home.

    But if anybody thinks that you can put a wall up, or pull them over and it will stop them from coming over the border you're nuts. Our jails are nicer than some of their homes, these people literally risk their lives to get here, Why? For the chance to earn a decent living...If they can't do that they won't come.

    They've already made rope ladders to go over the wall that cost us a ton of money, they've alerady got tunnels built that go under the wall, they'll get here if there is opportunity.
     
    PRC, May 1, 2010
  10. daugherty

    Bifferwine I am a girl

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    Here is some info on it. This new national ID card would replace the national ID cards we all have now -- paper Social Security cards. These new cards would be "tamper proof" in order to prevent illegal immigrants from gaining employment in the US. Scanners would be needed to read these new cards. Apparently a lot of illegals are able to work using fake Social Security cards, and this would supposedly cut down on that. The only examples I see that have been given of what kind of information it would contain is fingerprints.

    The push for these ID cards is bipartisan, led by Sens. Chuck Schumer (D., N.Y.) and Lindsey Graham (R., S.C.).

    The biggest objections to the biometric cards may come from privacy advocates, who fear they would become de facto national ID cards that enable the government to track citizens.

    "It is fundamentally a massive invasion of people's privacy," said Chris Calabrese, legislative counsel for the American Civil Liberties Union. "We're not only talking about fingerprinting every American, treating ordinary Americans like criminals in order to work. We're also talking about a card that would quickly spread from work to voting to travel to pretty much every aspect of American life that requires identification."

    Mr. Graham says he respects those concerns but disagrees. "We've all got Social Security cards," he said. "They're just easily tampered with. Make them tamper-proof. That's all I'm saying."


    Ezra Klein - Is a biometric, national ID card an immigration game changer?

    Worker ID Card at Center of Immigration Plan - WSJ.com
     
    Bifferwine, May 1, 2010
  11. daugherty

    VAreef

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    Well yeah America is still for the short while the land of oportunity. As for the fines though it won't matter. Come on... the threat of death won't stop murder. The threat of jail won't stop thieves. The threat of tickets won't stop speeders. The threat of bankrupcy is going to stop illegal hiring??
     
    VAreef, May 1, 2010
  12. daugherty

    bjohanson1234 .........

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    No it wont, but it might actually cause the accountants who do their risk annalysis to tell the big wigs that it will be cheaper to higher US citizens and legal immigrants with work VISA's instead of illegal immigrants.
     
    bjohanson1234, May 1, 2010
  13. daugherty

    VAreef

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    The article I read also said it would be required to obtain work in the USA and no one other than an employer would be allowed to require you to show it. Yeah right. Um how they gonna fingerprint you. But really it's a non starter atm since it's been canned
     
    VAreef, May 1, 2010
  14. daugherty

    Bifferwine I am a girl

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    Not the threat. The actual act itself. If the businesses that knowingly hire illegals go out of business and aren't able to operate, there won't be anyone left to hire them. The businesses that thrive and survive will be the ones that follow the laws. The vast majority of employers already follow the laws. The ones that hire illegals are in the minority. And it wouldn't be hard to root them out and put them out of business.
     
    Bifferwine, May 1, 2010
  15. daugherty

    Bifferwine I am a girl

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    I agree with you. But I'll point out that anyone that was born in the US already has their fingerprints on file. They were taken at your birth ;)
     
    Bifferwine, May 1, 2010
  16. daugherty

    bjohanson1234 .........

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    How are these reasonably suspicious activities to think that the people doing these are illegal immigrants? I know and work with several legal workers who have thick foriegn accents. Why should they be harrassed if they get pulled over?
    ALOT of people drive without a license, insurance, or registration. Does this make them illegal immigrants? No.

    Like I said, the only way to make this not profiling is to check EVERY ONE pulled over for their legal status. Because if it isnt everyone, it will only be select groups. Like the foreigners who have thick heavy accents. Which BTW would be racial profiling.
     
    bjohanson1234, May 1, 2010
  17. daugherty

    VAreef

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    My sons were not. One had a heal print the other 2 had nothing. None of them have ever had their fingerprints taken.
     
    VAreef, May 1, 2010
  18. daugherty

    Bifferwine I am a girl

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    Really? I have a copy of prints of every toe and every finger for myself (I was born in CA).
     
    Bifferwine, May 1, 2010
  19. daugherty

    bjohanson1234 .........

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    I believe it is on a more local level. I think that I had my foot prints recorded at birth, then later in grade school was finger printed as an Officer Freindly program or something like that.
     
    bjohanson1234, May 1, 2010
  20. daugherty

    VAreef

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    None of my sons or my Wife have been ever fingerprinted. I have been fingerprinted twice myself. Once for a security clearance and once for a misdimeaner.
     
    VAreef, May 1, 2010
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