Newbie with water chemistry question

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Reefing newb
Hello everyone,

I set up my 75 gallon tank on Saturday with 40 pounds of live substrate. Tested the water and everything was clear. I've added live rock about 25 pounds of live rock on Monday along with 3 cheap Damsels.

I just tested my water and here are the numbers
PH 8
Ammonia .50
Nitrite .50
Nitrate 20

Are these numbers normal for in process cycling?

Thanks everyone.

Bill
 
They at getting there, monitor those levels daily, watch the fish and remember, Ammonia, nitrites and nitrates are Toxic to fish, You might want to visit the store again and 2 products to look into are, Ammo lock, and a nitrite and nitrate toxin blocker, but it will take more time to cycle the tank. Look through the site for great water chemistry write-ups and be patient.

I wasn't and its cost me huge.

I hope all goes well, if you do lose the fish, just let the tank cycle before you add more, more live rock Will help.
 
Thank you. If reading into my numbers is possible I'd say I'm probably on the early side of cycling since the Ammonia and nitrite higher than nitrate.
 
Just to reiterate, you should take the fish back. Leaving them in the tank while it is cycling is cruel.
Especially since I didn't see damsels on your fish wish list in your other post. Best to get them out now.
 
You can keep the ammonia and nitrates low by doing 50% water changes during the cycle. Catching the damsels may be more trouble than its worth. There is nothing easy about catching damsels.
 
+1 Erin You should never use live animals to cycle a tank!! That is just cruel. Through a piece of table shrimp in and let it do your cycle.


I was told to add the the fish by my dealer and was told the damsels will survive it. Not looking to argue just point out the fact that many other sites say you should have fish present during this process as well. Will I be buying more fish? No. But im not bringing these guys back. They wouldn't be accepted by the store even if I tried.

Unlike many, I have done some research and most of what I have read says you need fish. See below.

The Nitrogen Cycle
HowManyFish.com Starter Guide: Aquarium Cycling
Nitrogen Cycle | Betta Fish Care
 
can you cycle using fish .. Yes.. Should you cycle with fish .. No.. fish are NOT necessary to cycle a tank and should not be used to do so.. Just because one fish can survive it doesnt mean we should subject them to it.. It was once thought (years ago) that it was necessary to cycle having a fish in the tank... But now as we all now , it isnt.. So why do some LFS's do it? Not caring about the customer and only his/ her money.. A total disregard for the fish that he is selling...
 
Even if the fish survive the cycle, you will have shorten their life considerably, they are essentially living in a toxic soup. The next problem you have is that you have damsels in the tank. They are some of the most aggressive fish you can buy and will likely bully any other fish you add to the tank to death.
 
It would have been easier and less cruel to have taken your time and not add any fish. But people make mistakes. Just take your time.

Guy, all the material I've read, my friends, as well as the store I bought it at said to do it. As far as being cruel, most studies suggest fish lack a cental nervous system that enables them to feel pain. Maybe there is an agenda at play here and that's all good. I however have read a lot and have asked a ton of questions and have always sided with the consistent answer. It's only since I've come to this site that I'm hearing the opposite.

Maybe in time, I'll elevate 3, one inch fish to the same level as a dog or cat, but until then, these are just 3, one inch fish. Let's be real.
 
There's no agenda here, just people that care for their fish. Yeah I have 7 cats and I certainly mourn the loss of them more than my fish, but I still want what is best for my fish too. And that is to provide them with a healthly and safe environment.
 
Pain is actually one of them most important signals a body can experience and I promise you fish feel pain just as much as a dog, cat, person or even a worm. The sensation of pain is very important in protecting our bodies.

And you attitude of "its just a fish" wont fly very far here. All of my fish recognize me and not the other people in my house, because I am their primary care giver. They always come up to visit when I sit by the tank.

I also dont know where you are doing your research but any up to date article or forum wont tell you to cycle a tank with live fish, there are far better methods to do so. Also it is to a LFS advantage if they sell you a fish that will die in your care because you are going to go back and replace the fish, making them more money.
 
Pain is actually one of them most important signals a body can experience and I promise you fish feel pain just as much as a dog, cat, person or even a worm. The sensation of pain is very important in protecting our bodies.

And you attitude of "its just a fish" wont fly very far here. All of my fish recognize me and not the other people in my house, because I am their primary care giver. They always come up to visit when I sit by the tank.

I also dont know where you are doing your research but any up to date article or forum wont tell you to cycle a tank with live fish, there are far better methods to do so. Also it is to a LFS advantage if they sell you a fish that will die in your care because you are going to go back and replace the fish, making them more money.

Pain and instinctive response are two different things. Just because something looks like its in pain isn't. A chicken running around after it's head has been cut off feels o pain. In order to feel pain, you need a central nervous system, which fish appear to lack as per the opinion of most scientists.

My research has been simple. Type into google "should fish be Present in a cycling tank?" see what all the other "expert sites" are saying.
My books are "the New Marine Aquarium" by Michael S. Paletta
My two friends have been doing this for years.
My shop is highly respected on Long Island and I've even asked other shops the same
questions for a second opinion.

You're not giving bad advise but if you understood the definition of cruelty you'd see why in my case I find insulting after the 5th time someone has stated it. The act, in and of itself is not cruel. It's the intention that is cruel. After weeks of reading, and asking questions, you are the first to suggest what I'm doing is cruel. Maybe some like to dive into a $1500 investment knowing nothing, but I havnt made it in life doing so.

PS - how did when get so off topic when all I asked is for people to comment on my water and why three fish refuse to swim to the other side of my tank?

If this is the welcome you give all new folks I offer my apologies for joining a private club.
 
Your OP in this thread was actually a water question... not the question about the fish staying to one side of the tank. A question that I answered for you.

It is true that we don't hold fish up to the level as dogs and cats, but a life is still a life. I loved this site as a newbie because I appreciated the straightforward advice these people gave me even if it was contrary to what my LFS told me. We stand to make no money off of you, and no matter how respected your LFS is, they are still a business.

I would state my point again, but at the risk of offending you further I will not. As far the "welcome you give all new folks", we are welcoming. I answered your question quickly and to the best of my knowledge and experience. Others then chimed in and did the the same. If it looks like we ganged up on you, I apologize, but you have to realize we all care about these animals. Even if they are just one inch fish. The "private club" only feels that way because your opinion is contrary to ours.
 
Wow, just wow. First off, fish do have a central nervous system. ALL vertebrates do. Do they feel pain? I don't know. Is it cruel to put them in a situation that COULD cause them pain IF they did? Yes it is.

Most sites do say to cycle with fish. In order to produce ammonia. Most of those sites also mention that the fish will most likely die of become sick. Is it cruel to put a fish knowingly into a situation that it could possibly die? Yes it is.

My question is why do that when some fish food or a piece of raw shrimp would do the same thing?
 
I guess if Google says its okay it will be okay..... If you think I am some left wing liberal animal rights activist then you are mistaking. I just do not want to see any animal suffer and that is making the animal suffer. And if you really wanted to know stuff you wouldn't be so defensive. A person willing to learn would ask why we believe what we do and not say you are all idiots with an agenda! Our agenda is that we want this hobby to survive and not hurt animals in the process. And we do not want a bad name put to our hobby.
 
i was told years ago that you needed fish to cycle a tank (20 or more years ago) - now we know that that is not the case - maybe the shop owner is still stuck in the old days caus it worked then why not now - i'm still working on gathering items for my build and reading everything in here and let me say this site is great tons of info and cool people - will be prob. 4 months before i see a fish in a tank
 
Dude, you are right, most stores won't take them back and you are kind of stuck.
You have done the research and yes watching the levels, doing the changes, just means its going to take a little longer on the cycle, but you'll get there, and when you do get ready to do the research and go to the store armed and informed.

Happy New Year.
 
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