Please HELP: 3 fish DEAD in the past 4 Days?

Discussion in 'Reef Fishes' started by superior, Jun 18, 2009.

  1. superior

    superior

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    Hello everybody I have a 180 Gallon tank that has been very stable for a over 9 months. (I got the tank from a friend of mine, and he had it for about 5 years i trasnported the water in this setup so the tank is very seasoned). Recently I decided to do a good Cleaning (I scrubbed the alge off the sides of the tank and the back) I usually don't scrub the back or sides only the front of the glass) About 3 days after i cleaned the tank here is what happened:

    1st my Chocolate Tang Died (he was hiding back in the rocks for the 3 days before he died, and had white spots on his body ich)

    2nd my yellow-eyed tang died this morning (he was swimming around and suddenly he died) (whitish film around his body)

    3rd I came home tonight and my Sail-Fin Tang was dead. (whiteish film allover his body & pinholes in his fins)

    4th (Next?) My Rabbit fish has ich (white spots)

    I noticed that there was some ick outbreak on the Chocolate Tang (white dots), but on the yellow-eyed tang & the Sail-Fin Tang there were no white dots - there was a foggy whitish film covering their bodies and the sailfin looked like there ware pinhole holes in his fins that you could see straight through?

    The PH / Ammonia / Specific Gravity / Nitrates / are all in balance. I just added my first treatment of "Marine-Max" (Tropical Science) to try to help get rid of whatever infection is happening inside my tank. I also purchased a bottle of "Ich Attach" (AquaHerbals) but I have not used it yet. I'm hoping that these treatments will not harm my soft & sps Corals?

    I'm about to do a 30 Gallon Water change right now. I'll be coming back soon to check on any of your recommendations or ideas.

    PS: I have about 225 snails and about 120 crabs in the tank and about 3 sand-sifting starfish (so my cleanup crew is pretty well stocked) I have noticed some hair alge starting to grow over the past 2 months but now it has stopped spreading or at least it has stopped slowing down. I recently added about 150 nassaris snails (included in the 225) to improve the balance of the tank.

    I must also mention that I do not have a quarantine tank because it is way to difficult to catch my fish and get them out of the tank. I have way to much rock in the way and It would take me quite a long time to get the rock out. So I'm trying to treat with Marine-Mas or Ich Attach, I just dont want to hurt my SPS or Soft Coarls? Suggestions?
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2009
    superior, Jun 18, 2009
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  2. superior

    superior

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    Oh forgot to mention that my ASM G2 has been working very hard the past week (ever since the cleaning).

    Good thing I was able to get the dead fish out because I have about 350-450lbs of live rock stacked very high in the back (the tank is 36" tall, so it's hard to get to the bottom of things without moving the rocks

    I used a coat-hanger wire to pull them out far enough to get the grabbers to pull the dead fish out (R.I.P)
     
    superior, Jun 18, 2009
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  3. superior

    mng777777 Shark Wrangler Wannabe

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    Both those treatments say they are safe for coral which makes me think they are either inneffective or not good for coral. Either way I would try to QT if you can if for no other reason, your meds will go a lot further if you're not treating 180 gals.

    what does your stock list look like? Ich is usually the result of overstocking and less likely that you just stirred something up by scrubbing algae. Is there anything that could be causing stress? Have you checked for voltage in the system?
     
    mng777777, Jun 18, 2009
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  4. superior

    superior

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    Here is the remaining stock in my tank:

    1 Large Chocolate Tang (dead)
    1 Small-med Sailfin Tang (dead)
    1 small-med yellow-eyed Tang (Dead)

    ALIVE:

    1 Med-Large Rabbit Fish (ich on him)
    1 Large Big-Eyed Soldier fish (healthy)
    1 Large Yellow Tang (healthy)
    1 small Clown (healthy)
    1 small Unicorn Tang (some fuzz for the past week, looks like cotton but improving)
    1 small Damsel (healthy)
    1 small Chromis (healthy)
    3 Cleaner Shrimp
    5 Emerald Crabs
    2 Sally Light-foot crabs
    175 Nassaris snails
    100 Hermit Crabls (blue & red legged)
    3 Sand Sifting Star Fish
    about 100 lbs of live sand (it's about 3 inches thick)
    Fair amount of Corals birds-nest, leathers, plate, about 8 more different coals few others (all are healthy and looking good)

    Haven't checked for voltage I will do this after the water change.

    I'm running my UV 24 hours a day (until the tank looks healthy again) then back to 5 hours a day
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2009
    superior, Jun 18, 2009
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  5. superior

    Phroger

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    It sounds like you have two types of parasites. The white film resembles Marine Velvet disease (which is highly contagious) and of course you already identified the Ich. Unfortunately, for the velvet disease when it starts to show as a film, it is already too late for the fish. I can't give any suggestion for treating without a quarantine tank since the only way I've been able to find is to treat with copper. It is usually triggered by a sudden exposure to ammonia, nitrites, or nitrates which may have happened when you did the deep scrubbing. Here is a picture of a fish with Velvet disease to possibly help identify: http://www.fishdeals.com/fish_diseases/oodinium_velvet/photos/velvet.jpg
     
    Phroger, Jun 18, 2009
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  6. superior

    superior

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    Yeah the velvet disease is what it looks like to me. I'm running my UV bulb 24/7 for the meantime, combined with water-change, do you think there is any hope? Look at my stock list in the above message
     
    superior, Jun 18, 2009
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  7. superior

    Phroger

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    I'm still kind of new at identifying and treating diseases in Marine aquariums so somebody else would have to take a stab at cures.

    The site I've found so far with the best detail is here: Medicine Chest:  Velvet Disease

    Sorry I couldn't be of more help, but I don't want to steer you into the wrong direction with bad advice.
     
    Phroger, Jun 18, 2009
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  8. superior

    mng777777 Shark Wrangler Wannabe

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    Is there any way that you can get a QT set up?
     
    mng777777, Jun 18, 2009
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  9. superior

    superior

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    Yes I can get a QT Setup, the only problem is trying to get the fish out. I have so much live rock I'd have to pull it all out, there is like 250-350 pounds of live rock. What a nightmare to take out. I have an extra 18 gallon tank with everything I need to setup a QT. I'm not sure if this is large enough for my fish?
     
    superior, Jun 18, 2009
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  10. superior

    mng777777 Shark Wrangler Wannabe

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    I use food pellets in two nets. Place the nets in the water with the pellets in them, facing each other and when the fish goes in to eat, push the nets together to trap the fish.
     
    mng777777, Jun 18, 2009
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  11. superior

    superior

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    Good Idea, I can try this, however I only have an 18 gallon tank that I can setup as QT. I think I would need to get a larger one for my fish.
     
    superior, Jun 18, 2009
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  12. superior

    dcantucson

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    The problem is also when fish are sick a lot of times food is of no interest. :grumble:
     
    dcantucson, Jun 18, 2009
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  13. superior

    dcantucson

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    Superior- I had the same problem in my large tank so I treated the entire tank with reef safe meds. I hope you are successful. I wasn't. I think those meds are not effective. I also kill a lot of corals as it screwed up my water quality. It may be better to lose some fish than everything. Good luck.
     
    dcantucson, Jun 18, 2009
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  14. superior

    tankedchemist

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    Just curious, but what did you use to scrub the algae off?
     
    tankedchemist, Jun 18, 2009
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  15. superior

    dcantucson

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    A true chemist's question. I thought of that too, but thought ...no!
     
    dcantucson, Jun 18, 2009
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  16. superior

    superior

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    I used acrylic safe scrubbing pads
     
    superior, Jun 18, 2009
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  17. superior

    dcantucson

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    Is there anything that could have gotten into the water and weakened your fishes defenses? Did you add anything new in the recent past?
     
    dcantucson, Jun 18, 2009
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  18. superior

    mng777777 Shark Wrangler Wannabe

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    You are still probably going to have to go at it with two nets, and a TON of patience. remove some LR if you have to, drop those nets in on each side, and wait. The best chance you have to save that fish and protect the others is to get it into QT. Good Luck.
     
    mng777777, Jun 18, 2009
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  19. superior

    Piggy

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    Did you do a water change after you did this? I would try and get the fish out with the marine velvet. Seeing you only have a small QT, I catch my fish with a homemade trap. I use a soda bottle cut it and make a trap door. Kind of hard to explain. Usually ick will take it's course. Also soak their food in garlic. Keep us updated.
     
    Piggy, Jun 18, 2009
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  20. superior

    mng777777 Shark Wrangler Wannabe

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    I think his fish are too big for the old soda bottle trick...
     
    mng777777, Jun 18, 2009
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