Setting up from scratch - no canister filter?!

[llr]

It's been about 20 years since I've had a salt aquarium. I am in the very beginning of setting up a 72 gallon bow front. I was just working on gathering my equipment and making a list. After looking over the forum, I was surprised to see recommendations to NOT use a canister filter.

If I don't use a canister, then what else should I have? Just live sand and rock and a powerhead? Also, what flow rate/how many power heads would you recommend?

Have I understood that I don't need to add a protein skimmer until I am ready to begin adding corals and invertebrates?

The live sand and rock ratio? 1 pound per gallon?

Thanks for your help - no sense in starting out all wrong :)

 

[salt_for_brains]

Hi and welcome to the forum!
Canister filters trap a lot of nitrates if not cleaned often and properly so most in the hobby stay away from them. Your live rock will provide your filtration.

Depending on what corals you are planning on keeping you 10-40x turn over rate in your display and 3-5x turn over rate in your sump

A protein skimmer is not necessary during the cycle but I would run it as soon as the cycle is over. You will be adding a small clean up crew after the cycle as well.

Google "sand bed calculator" to figure how much sand you need. Enter your tanks footprint and the sand depth you want and it will give you what you need. I like about a 2" depth. 1-2lbs of live rock per/gal and I like the 2lbs better. Good luck!

 

[mng777777]

you are off to a good start. Canisters are now considered unwelcome in the saltwater world. They become nitrate factories and will produce more waste than they remove. The protein skimmer has less to do with coral and more to do with overall bio-load. The skimmer is a tool for removing waste. The LR and Sand will setup your natural filtration, but upon adding fish, you'll need a vehicle to remove the excess waste. Your choices are skimmer, water changes, algae, or a combination thereof. You can get by with less when it's fish only as they tend to have a higher tolerance to nitrates and changes in water quality than corals, but without the skimmer, you'll still need to address the issue of water quality in some other fashion. 1lb LR per GAL is a good starting point. Take your time, enjoy the build, ask lots of questions along the way, and don't forget to post pics for us here :)

 

[mariobrothersleeve]

I have an mp40 at 50% and a 1050gph powerhead and it still moves my sand bed. Its hard to not get dead spots in a 72g bow front but that mp40 does magic! Most run another tank called a sump to store their protein skimmer, microalgae, more liverock, and refugium. It keeps a more "natural" looking display tank. Good luck

 

[chichimom79]

Welcome aboard! You can save money by getting mostly dry rock and putting a few live rock pieces around the dry rock.

 

[AnthonyTheNewbie]

If you want to use a canister, I'd recommend removing the media inside of it and stuffing it full of LR rubble. The reason you don't need a external filter in this hobby is because LR/Sand build up beneficial bacteria that help complete the nitrogen cycle. By not having a skimmer, you'll have to do pretty regular water changes (10% weekly after the cycle). In my 55g, I don't have a sump (well, I do, just not active till I re-do the DIY overflow) or a Skimmer. But, I change 10% weekly. Other then that, good idea with checking on stuff first! Welcome aboard, and look forward to your progress!

Once you actually set your tank up, make a thread in the tank showcase thread so people can follow :)

 

[Greenman]

I use a Eheim Canister on my 55gallon. I removed all media and put 3 media bags inside. Filled 2 with Carbon and 1 with PhosSorb

 

[SarahSmile]

A lot of reefers I meet in the "real world" use canister filters. They look at me like I'm nuts when I spout the living reefs mantra of "protein skimmers are best, canister filters are nitrate factories." I guess whatever works for ya if you're going to be diligent about cleaning, thou, having ran a protein skimmer and then a canister for a while, the skimmer is waaaay easier. I hate cleaning.

 

[mariobrothersleeve]

A lot of reefers I meet in the "real world" use canister filters. They look at me like I'm nuts when I spout the living reefs mantra of "protein skimmers are best, canister filters are nitrate factories." I guess whatever works for ya if you're going to be diligent about cleaning, thou, having ran a protein skimmer and then a canister for a while, the skimmer is waaaay easier. I hate cleaning.

Well, i think you should change your name to sarahsmiles except mondays and every other thursdays.

 

[llr]

Sooo...the more I read, the more questions I have. Regarding a sump - to me that just sounds like if I remove all the filter media from the canister, and add live rock instead I (almost) have a sump? Minus a place to hide a protein skimmer?

What is the real benefit to a sump? Just that I get to hide the protein skimmer and have some additional live rock/bioballs?

I currently have a 75 gallon freshwater aquarium with discus, so I'm no stranger to regular water changes (as in daily or a minimum of 4 a week) and fussy/sensitive fish. If I run a protein skimmer, can I get away with making infrequent water changes? I'm happy to not run the canister or a sump at all, but if I can do fewer water changes that might sway me!

I know the key to success is start slow, with a good set-up and be patient. So live rock and sand - cycle 4 to 5 weeks, depending on my nitrate/nitrite levels, then add my cleaner crew.

Since I am not in a hurry, is there any reason to buy cured vs uncured rock?

Thanks for all the advice!

 

[Greenman]

Sumps are nice because you can house all your filter stuff inside there and keep your DT nice and clean looking. Not to mention they're superior to anything else at maintaining chemicals. You can keep your heater, skimmer ect. inside of the sump.

 

[mariobrothersleeve]

If you dont want a sump, do a hob protein skimmer.

Buy a couple lbs of lr and the rest in base rock, this helps you save alot of money.

Frequent w/c promotes a healthy environment. More water ie sumps will help ensure steady parameters.

If you pull all your filters out and put lr rubble, you will have the exact same issues. Open top is the key and with all that waste settling in your canister creates more trates.

It is totally up to you what enviroment you want to have in your system, most of us here are trying to give the best possible chance to not have a tank crash. Good luck.

 

[AnthonyTheNewbie]

Sooo...the more I read, the more questions I have. Regarding a sump - to me that just sounds like if I remove all the filter media from the canister, and add live rock instead I (almost) have a sump? Minus a place to hide a protein skimmer?

What is the real benefit to a sump? Just that I get to hide the protein skimmer and have some additional live rock/bioballs?

The real benefit to having a sump, like others have said, is to hide all the equipment that would normally go in your display tank. For example: Heater and Macro algae. Also, it gives pods a place to breed so there is a constant stream of live food for your fish. It also increases your total water volume, which in turn helps keep your fluctuations from hitting the tank as hard. That's why, in this hobby, they say that beginners should go bigger! Smaller tanks are usually for those with some experience under their belt (Not always the case though! Some people dive into the hobby with a nano tank and do great! But, I'm diverging!).

I currently have a 75 gallon freshwater aquarium with discus, so I'm no stranger to regular water changes (as in daily or a minimum of 4 a week) and fussy/sensitive fish. If I run a protein skimmer, can I get away with making infrequent water changes? I'm happy to not run the canister or a sump at all, but if I can do fewer water changes that might sway me!

I know the key to success is start slow, with a good set-up and be patient. So live rock and sand - cycle 4 to 5 weeks, depending on my nitrate/nitrite levels, then add my cleaner crew.

Since I am not in a hurry, is there any reason to buy cured vs uncured rock?

Uncured rock will cause a cycle in your tank. Most people use uncured rock to cycle their tank. Cured rock won't cause a cycle.

Also, as others have said, don't buy a ton of live rock. Even if you are rich and can afford it :p. Buy base rock (dead rock) for your tank, aquascape it how you like it, and then pick up a small amount of LR (For example, if you have a 75g tank, pick up like 60 lbs of base rock and 15lbs of live rock). The base rock will be live within a month, however, it won't look live for several months (algae growth).
Thanks for all the advice!

Your welcome from everyone, and welcome aboard! Don't forget pictures! We love pictures! :)