Nitrates

[reefkeeper55]

In an earlier thread I posted the specifics of my filtration system, and I now have the Aqua C 240 EV installed which is pulling out a small amount of brown crud but my nitrates are still high. Hopefully when I get Biff's magical chaeto they will drop somewhat but now I'm wondering if it might be coming from my wet/dry. Where the tank water enters the wet dry system I removed the bio balls probably a year or so ago and have only small pieces of tennis to baseball sized live rock. I do not have a sock but I do have a piece of filter media that catches some of the detriment from the tank. I was wondering if I remove all of this small live rock and add it back to the DT would that be beneficial, and also could I put Biff's chaeto in there since I really don"t have a lot of room where the return pumps are located? All other parameters are dead on, so the high nitrates are my only problem, other than my 6 yr old Sailfin seems to have developed an appetite for Xenias...he and my Koran have buzzed my last two pieces I put in...I think he learned it from the Koran....any help would be appreciated..thanks:D

 

[Bifferwine]

If you don't have bioballs, the wet dry probably wouldn't be contributing to it, unless you don't keep the filter media clean. Do you clean it?

That would be a good place for the chaeto if there is a place to put a light.

What are your nitrates at? Do you use sand or crushed coral substrate? Tap or RODI water? What type of foods do you feed, how often and how much?

Sorry if these are repeat questions, but I'll try to get to the bottom of this! :)

PS -- your chaeto should be there any day now; I sent it last week.

 

[reefkeeper55]

thanks Biff- depending on which test kit I use they still range from 80 to 160 - its a pretty dark red pretty quick if I use the API or a somwhat dark purple using the nutrafin kit - I have an RO system that I use- have never used tap water -crushed coral substrate probably 2 to 3 inches deep- tons of live rock that is probably 4 or 5 yrs old with lots o f coraline - just a sheet of fiber media that I have just laying on top of the rock in the wet/dry-before I tell you how much food i'm using just remember the sailfin and the koran are as big as a saucer if not bigger- 3 yellow tangs, (sm, med. lg). 1 large Naso, 1 lg Regal tang, 3 sm chromis, 2 med clarkiis - I usually just use frozen cubes of mysis, brine shrimp and also use a sheet of jumbo mysis for the sailfin and koran.....I normally put 2 0r 3 cubes of the brine or mysis and break a hunk off of the sheet about the size of a quarter or so for the sailfin and koran- they also get a whole sheet of seaweed pretty much everyday.. I have just started alternating a little flake and a little spectrum pellets just for a variety- I saw where you told someone you feed every other day so I might be feeding them too much....they are all as fat as pigs ...as far as putting the chaeto where my bioballs used to be I have room to add a light and let it just lay on top of the wet/ dry itself but unless i take out the sm pieces of rock it will not be under the water...iI could put it where the pumps are but my space there is limited....thanks Biff

 

[little_fish]

That is a ton of food, and all that extra is getting caught in the crushed coral, rotting and releasing the nitrates back. Its also catching all the fish poop and other junk to rot and release back nitrates. That is exactly why we dont recommend using crushed coral.

I would cut your feeding to half that and start removing the crushed coral. Just suck out a small section with each water change so you dont stir up so much you cause a cycle.

Remove the crushed coral and you will see your nitrates go down.

 

[reefkeeper55]

and replace with what.....sand?

 

[little_fish]

yep, or you could go with a bare bottom. personal choice

 

[reefkeeper55]

I do gravel wash with every other H2o chg, and in the beginning it was quite dirty but now it isn't all that bad....removing all of the substrate from a 150 gal would be quite an undertaking, not to say it wouldn't be worth it if it removed the nitrates...Biff is also working on this for me and I am waiting for some of her chaeto which should be here in a day or so......thanks little_fish

 

[little_fish]

I dont think cheato alone is going to solve your nitrate problems. I really really really suggest getting that stuff out of there and feeding less.

 

[Bifferwine]

The crushed coral is probably not helping you any, especially 2 or 3 inches of it. Removing that from your tank would be a huge hassle, I can see why you'd want to do that as a last resort.

I can't remember if you've mentioned, do you use RODI or tap water?

 

[reefkeeper55]

R/O ... I have never used tap

 

[reefkeeper55]

r / o

 

[Bifferwine]

Do you have visible algae in your tank? Pest algae?

 

[reefkeeper55]

only just a little each day when I get home it just looks like the brown diaton probably only the total area of maybe 3/4 of a dollar bill on the front glass and the sides combined

 

[phastroh]

WHoa I have 80lbs of crushed coral. I had been trying to remove all the bigger pieces that seem to have someway worked their way to the top.

Maybe this is why my Nitrates are at 40.

This LFS near me says 40 really is not too bad and that is what I have read at a few places as well.

This store does some great work and maintenance as well here is their link Creative Aquariums of Tampa

Yeah next tank I will use regular sand and maybe just a little crushed coral sprinkled in for look but not the whole floor.

 

[little_fish]

your lfs is filling you full of lies to an extent. That is ok if you are running a FOWLR system, but not if you have a reef.

And ya, i would remove that crushed coral, this is why we say dont use it. Because it become full of crap and release nitrates back out to the water column.

And i would say that that is why your starfish died - toxic levels of nitrates. Your other critters are living through some fluke, but the starfish obviously couldnt take it.

 

[phastroh]

I do not have anything but fish and rock. Well ok I have critters but common how can it be a fluke for 2 fish, an Eel, 2 Anemones, 2 Mantis 2 Brittles and many many crabs, snails and hermits to be living for months in that water.

Also there is still one of the Starfish left that is fine and dandy.

I can't say you are wrong but everything is happy and zippy around the tank.

The only new additions were the Eel, one fish and the stars.

 

[phastroh]

Ok so I was looking and found this crushed coral vs sand???? - The Reef Tank

In it there is a post about a long study on crush coral and other comments.

 

[ErinCahir]

Fish are hardier when it comes to parameter swings than inverts are. And starfish are much more sensitive than crabs and shrimp are.
Your brittle stars have been in the tank since the beginning.

How did you acclimate the starfish? You said you had the one that died in another container... how long did you mix the water before you added the starfish?

 

[ErinCahir]

I would like to see the actual study.

I think you should start taking the crushed coral out. You already have water quality issues, and I'm sure the crushed coral is not helping.

 

[phastroh]

That water had been mixing for maybe 3 days. I made the mistake of mixing and adding in the same day once and now I wait no less than 2 days.

I have a water pump with a hose and a 500GPH powerhead in my Brute(along with a heater)

I pour in 24 Gallons of my RO/DI then my Instant Ocean Salt and mix with a big PVC pipe which I am going to replace with an Oar haha.

I then toss in the heated and pump and then stick the powerhead on and let it mix up.

I just wish I could have saved the star but his pal is ok. The one that is ok loves to stay right at the overflow all wedge up there. I took it down for the water change and he was back quickly.

I let them both sit in the tank for almost 2 hours and gave them 1/4 water like every 15 minutes. I read I could have done it slower but they were cool for maybe a week and then that.

Trust me I felt the worst. I didn't think It would bother me so much but it is like why should I even have a tank if this is what happens.

I posted a thread about getting the right stuff to deal with this kind of thing if you check in the New To Reefing Forum.

I remember Ambersunrise saying (I think) something about chopping off the bad part but uhhhh not me without knowing more first.

Also I can't take 80LBs out that is under 160LBS of rock with all those animals in there. I already was thinking about it.

I noticed that under all of the bigger pieces it does get somewhat fine. I took out all the shell on the floor so stuff can get in there and was going to lightly comb over anything big in the front at least and take it out and put in in the fuge.