Addition of Live Rock

[Max125g]

While I am finishing up preparations on my tank I wanted to ask a question about the addition of live rock. My tank is a 125g and I was planning on cycling it with live sand and only a few pieces of live rock. After the initial cycle is it ok to add pieces of live rock one at a time, or will each piece cause the tank to go through a mini cycle? Part of my reason is that I want to take my time and hand pick each piece of live rock. I don’t want to go to a shop (or order online) everything at once and be stuck with some possible pieces I can’t work with or don’t like.

Any suggestions for starting a tank this way would be greatly appreciated.

Also-is it recommended to “bury” the bottom pieces into the sand so they almost rest on the glass, or just place them on top of the sand?

 

[OhNoNemo]

If your getting all your LR from an LFS and will be getting it to your tank in short time there will be no die off....This is actually how i did it also.
You will want to place the rock on the bare bottom,then put your sand in.

 

[Jmck]

Well probably the easiest way is to put some live rock, and a peice of table shrimp in the tank to cause the cycle. Dont waste your money on live sand, it isnt worth it and normal sand will end up being better.

You dont have to use all live rock, you can use base rock which will become seeded and turn into live rock over time, but if you put live rock in one at a time, you Should not have any problems with a mini cycle depending on the size of the rock and how much dead stuff there is on it. If from the store, you keep it submerged in water and put it straight in your tank you will probably have less die-off.

 

[Jmck]

and Nemo, i disagree, rock should NOT be on the bare bottom, or you can risk breaking the glass. I think sand should go first.

 

[Bifferwine]

Josh, I have to agree with Nemo on this one. Rock should always go on the glass. If you put sand underneath the rock, what happens when your goby or snails start digging? They shift the sand, and the rock falls over, breaking your tank. I have heard of this happening frequently enough in this hobby that I am pretty confident in saying that rock should always be on a stable bottom -- the glass. You only risk breaking the glass if you are dropping the rock in the tank. If you place it down gently, the glass will be fine.

Sand shifts constantly in our tanks. The last thing you want is to have the sand holding up the weight of hundreds of pounds of rocks. It only takes a little bit of the sand moving to cause those rocks to come crashing down.

 

[Max125g]

well the live sand is no issue, ill be scuba diving for that. The challenge will be figuring out how to bring 80lb bucks of sand back up. Lift bags i guess.

The live rock i plan on picking up is from a store in the keys (only a 2 hour drive for me). For $3/lb i can hand select their rock right out of their rented watershed area. So put on my scuba gear (or snorkel most likely) swim down, see a nice piece i like, and bring it to the surface where they put it in some water and i drive home with it. (FYI, this is not reef rock, it is agricultured florida live rock done the legal way)

Josh-i was reading your cycling sticky and you mentioned not to do any water changes during the cycle? So for my plan, i would put a small layer of live sand, put the base live rock, then the rest of the sand, and just let it cycle on its own with no water changes? Then i can add live rock a piece at a time with no worry? (as long as the live rock does not incur much die-off)?

Sounds a lot easier then i thought. i was planning on buying 2 50g trash drums and keeping them filled with water next to my tank for water changes during the cycling. if i can avoid that it would be much easier and i would have a much less upset girlfriend :)

Thanks in advance as always!

 

[Jmck]

Well, I might have to change my tank a little bit biff! sorry nemo XD

If your getting the sand from the ocean, then you might not have an issue, just make sure the sand doesnt have a lot of crap in it, for example, in the bay near me, I cant use the water or sand because it has lots of waste in it making it dangerous for my tank.

yea, that sounds like a good idea max, just do what nemo and biff said, put the rocks on the glass, I didnt think about shifting it and having it fall. just remember, you cant add lots of live rock at once. becauase that will cause a mini cycle.

yea, if you do water changes during the cycle it can actually make it take longer :)

I think Yote was saying he used a small amount of live rock, and everything else was base. It all ends up becoming the same, so dont discriminate if you find base rock that looks like it has a good shape!

 

[Max125g]

Thanks!

Yea do have some worries about hte live sand, but my plan is to take it near the reef where i ususally dive. The plan is to harvest it from the outside of the reef (florida's barrier reef) in about 65-75' of water. I figure that due to the depth and the close proximety of the reef pollutants should be kept to a minimum. Let's hope

 

[Jmck]

yea, I hope so max, Personally, I would still go buy some normal sand, because they have cleaned it up properly. But, its more fun when you do it all yourself!

 

[OhNoNemo]

yea, I hope so max, Personally, I would still go buy some normal sand, because they have cleaned it up properly. But, its more fun when you do it all yourself!

+1 ,why risk it,just to save some pennies...sand is probably the cheapest think we get for our tanks at the start

 

[Max125g]

Its not to save cash, its to say "i picked this sand myself"

 

[Max125g]

not many people get the opportunity to build their reef tank from the ocean... legally that is.

 

[OhNoNemo]

OK,i get it....I'd just be worried about all the tiny bacterial ,parasitic,unhatched eggs of whatever, who knows what you could possibly be introducing.......:shock:...Theres just no way to know whats in the ocean sand.....JMHO,but happy scuba:sfish:

 

[Max125g]

Makes me wonder tho. Places like Tampa Bay Saltwater offer life sand that they harvest from the gulf. There is always the unknown risk i guess, but i have to take into consideration businesses like that who make a living off selling sand from the ocean.

 

[daugherty]

you can just take the steps to let is cycle and let the bad things die off.

 

[yote]

Just make sure you stay within the law.Those fish and game fines can bankrupt a person pretty quick.Not to mention the lose of the boat,truck,dive equipment.
But I'f had been where I could,I think live sand right off the reef would be the way to go.But I also like finding all those cool critters weather their bad OR good.

 

[Max125g]

Just make sure you stay within the law.Those fish and game fines can bankrupt a person pretty quick.Not to mention the lose of the boat,truck,dive equipment.
But I'f had been where I could,I think live sand right off the reef would be the way to go.But I also like finding all those cool critters weather their bad OR good.

Oh absolutely. Keeping within the law is a strong concern of mine, but even more so is practicing safe harvesting. That is my #1. As much as i am going to love my tank when its done, the most important thing is to ensure that my kids have the same opportunity as i did, both scuba and aquariums.

I have been researching the state website and other sources for nearly 3 months prior to even selling the freshwater/obtaining the saltwater tanks. Even to the point that i was not happy with the information that is out there (very hard to actually find info, you have to dig deep) so i have been compiling everything together in hops of self publishing a manual/guidebook to this very same topic :). Most of the items/livestock in/around the reef are way off limits, mainly the liverock itself, but there are a select few fish, sponges, corals, and inverts that are safe to grab. I'm just thankful the boat i use has a very nice livewell system to ensure the critters get back in great shape :)

When i mentioned above that i will be scuba/snorkeling for the liverock, it will be scuba/snorkeling at a facility that rents land from the state and has obtained the correct licenses/permissions to do so. Its a very neat practice, identical to the well known tampa bay saltwater. They allow their rock to "grow" for 3+ years before they take it back out, replenishing the stock each time a harvest is made. I think its old reef rock that is dug up from somewhere in the state, but then again i have heard it is some FL limestone.

For any other FL residents, you can find a great deal of info on what u can/can't take home with you here Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission . Or wait until i publish my book (hopefully with waterproof pages for easy underwater ID:))

 

[reeffreak]

Josh-i was reading your cycling sticky and you mentioned not to do any water changes during the cycle? So for my plan, i would put a small layer of live sand, put the base live rock, then the rest of the sand, and just let it cycle on its own with no water changes? Then i can add live rock a piece at a time with no worry? (as long as the live rock does not incur much die-off)?

There is some debate over doing water changes or not during the cycle.To preseve the life within the live rock,if ammonia gets too high(over 1) then do water changes.The choice is really up to you.It's much easier to do large water changes in a 30g. then a 125g during the cycle period.

To answer your questione earlier about adding live rock one at a time.That will definitely help keep ammonia from getting to high but does risk starting a small cycle everytime you add a piece.It will all depend on how long the LFS had the live rock.The longer the LFS had the rocks the more likely all the die-off has occurred in their tanks.

 

[Dantitan]

and Nemo, i disagree, rock should NOT be on the bare bottom, or you can risk breaking the glass. I think sand should go first.

What I did is, put the sand or substrate in the tank first . I then put the LR onto the bottom and pushed the LR into the sand using a twisting motion combined with a gentle downward push. That way you can take some of the pressure from the LR off of the glass and also have it flush to the bottom. JMO :D

 

[Ulta]

imo the BEST way to do it is to put eggcrate across the bottom, then the Rocks, then the sand. :)

And for the water changes, you should only do that to dilute your Nitrates (cycle end product) I'd say 3/4 of any life non bacterial will prolly die off during the cycle. If you want to give any life you have in there better chances at survival you can look into a few chemicals like ammo lock and stress zyme+ to make your cycle more safe (They allowed me to save all my fish and a few corals through a recent mishap where my tank went through a large cycle where my ammonia spiked ~5ppm) If not then do like the rest and let your tank cycle on its own. Once you are reading 0's and have added majority live rock to your system then you can safely start adding inhabitants in intervals.