New to skimmers

[fmjnax]

Making the transition from FW to SW and skimmers are a new idea to me. I understand how they work and what they're for. What I can't seem to grasp is how to plumb them in to the system.

Our setup will consist of a "HOB" overflow draining in to a 20 gallon long aquarium sump. My plans are to start with a DIY counter current skimmer as shown here: Snailman's DIY 4" Skimmer (I already have most of the PVC and fittings from leftovers of past projects. I'll buy one down the road if I have to). My dilema is that I can't figure out how to plumb it in.

I've attached an example of how I will be generally setting up the plumbing. Can someone help me work the skimmer in to this?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Pwny]

you can just get a skimmer for insump use and put it in your drain chamber (red) it will come with a small water pump that pumps water into it near the base and water will come out of the side. it can just sit on the bottom just make sure the skimmers foot print will fit. depending on how high you make your baffels you might need a stand so the skimmer works best. also put your bubble trap b4 your return pump chamber, also whats the horazontal line from return to drain? seams like it will just make a lot more head loss you can put the ball on the return staight to the tank to regulate flow.

 

[fastrd400]

Do you already have an external skimmer or are you building one? I say external just by your sketch, you have it out of the sump.

 

[Pwny]

i missed the diy skimmer part but it looks like same basic idea

 

[fmjnax]

fastrd, you are correct. The plan is to build an external skimmer (at least to start off with). My baffles are 8" tall and I read that the taller the skimmer, the better (cor counter current skimmers, anyway). The plan is to have it ~3' and sit behind the stand.

Pwny, you are also correct. The horizontal line simply returns water from the pump to the sump. Both return lines will have balls on it. I saw a site that recommended this and stated it would help regulate flow to the main tank and also provide the ability to isolate the sump from the main tank when messing around with the DSB and/or macroalgae. I'm guessing this extra line isn't common practice? I'll go ahead and remove it from my plan.

Finally, in the sump designs I have been using as my guide, the bubble trap was straight between the overflow chamber and the 'fuge. Can you explain why it should be between the 'fuge and pump chamber instead? It's no big deal to just turn the sump around, but I'd still like to know; just for knowledge sake. =)

Thanks!

 

[fastrd400]

Regarding your baffels, I think your correct in your thinking. Normally the baffels are seperating the return pump chamber from the fuge. Maybe it was drawn backwards by mistake?

 

[phastroh]

Just buy an Aqueon Sump. They are much easier and you can make an external fuge instead or not.

The Model 2 is what I use and it is great.

Just whatever you do, don't put the Skimmer Pump in any chamber that has water levels that are not constant because at least with mine the skimming level would go up and down with the water so I didn't get a full day of great skimming with the evaporation.

I finally plumbed it to the second(fuge) chamber and it is always at the same level no matter what.

 

[fmjnax]

Good advice, and much appreciated! I've already got my sump and overflow done and they are currently in-use (test) on a water-only setup in the shop, so buying a sump/overflow is not in the questions (at this time).

However, I still don't know how to plumb the skimmer in. Hehehe. Can I just "T" off of my drain line and feed it to the skimmer inlet and then have the skimmer outlet pump into the sump? I've attached another example.

Also, I read that with the counter-current skimmers, the less "turnover rate" the better. The specific site I am using as my guide (it's from 2001, so maybe it's rather outdated?) has a chart which lists me as wanting to have a pump no higher than 100 GPH. Is this logic still valid in the reef world today? If not, then what size pump should I look at to power the skimmer?

Thanks!

 

[phastroh]

I don't think that the skimmer will run efficiently with no pump because the water coming from the overflo wont be causing enough flow to really get.the water frothy.

I am no expert but I see companies that recomment big pumps for their skillets that I can't even believe it because of the waterflo they produce.

Just from anything I have read the more power the better.

 

[ErinCahir]

You can "T" it off the drain line. My set up is like yours (skimmer outside the sump) but we added ours after the system was already set up, so instead of having to replumb everything, we put a pump in the sump to get water to the skimmer.

EDIT: I just went and looked at the skimmer plans (which I should have done before giving out advice... oops). I am unsure now if plumbing it in will work (we have a recirculating skimmer... I forget that not everybody does).

 

[fmjnax]

I just went back and re-read the DIY plans from the site I'm using and it looks like I may have found my answer. It looks like I will need to place my skimmer pump in the first chamber of the sump. It will then pump the water to the top of the skimmer inlet. I plumb the bottom outlet of the skimmer back to the first chamber of the sump. The pump they recommend for this skimmer setup is a sub-100 GPH and the cleaned water and drained back to the same chamber, so it shouldn't mess with my water level in that chamber of the sump.

From what I've read on this site, I know this skimmer design isn't the "norm", but we are trying to pinch pennies on this setup (in case we decide that saltwater really isn't for us; we won't be out a huge bit of money). I already have EVERYTHING I need to build this skimmer from other various projects, except for the airstones and pump, so I figured it was worth a try. We've got a water-only setup in the shop that we are using to ensure that the plumbing is all solid, so I figured I would go ahead and build this and throw it in the mix.

All that said, I'm open to any other DIY or low-cost skimmer ideas.

 

[phastroh]

Yeah that is the same like me too but my skimmer unit sits in the third chamber where my return pump is just in case there is an overflo and I am not there to catch it.

But having your pump in a constant water depth chamber is a plus. I really only had overflos when I added water to the third chamber.

I am sure no-one keeps their skimmer pump in a chamber with changing water heights like I had it but I was only following what I read and saw which was wrong. The manufacturer recommends the pump sit between 1-3" under the waterline. If I move it from 1 to 3 by hand I can see the water in the skimmer move with it.

It was crazy when I thought I would be dealing with this and that everyone was doing this. By this I mean the following.

Water is at maximum(marked by sticker on sump) skimmer is skimming it up.

By the end of the the day the water needs to be replaced as it dropped a few inches from evaporation, skimmer has no water in the neck area so it is not skimming at all.

I add water and then the skimmer bubbles over because the water level went up so fast in the 3rd chamber.

I have seen setup where the Skimmer was outside and the skimmer pump was drilled right into the side of the first chamber where the overflo was dumping into. I would rather have it that way but the Aqueon has no room for that and has their bubble diffuser piping there with the sump socks.

They do recommend how to drill the sumps acrylic wall to install an external pump and bulkhead but at this point I am good and can't ruin a $250 sump or whatever it was.

Here is a link to how it looks Pic e

There is a lot more in there now but this is the original set-up.

My skimmer sit where that pump on the right is and the pump sits in the middle chamber but I have a hang on Refugium in the 2nd chamber which is also the refugium. I just place my Chaeto and some rock in the hang on so the Chaeto does get sucked into the pump.

The skimmer pump then sits on another pump that is stuck to the side of the hang on refugium. It blows water across the rocks and Chaeto. I put it on the pump to keep it near the top of the waterline. Plus it snags the water before it falls to the 3rd chamber.

I will take a pick of it now later.

 

[ErinCahir]

You could always run a scrubber...
https://www.livingreefs.com/mega-powerful-nitrate-and-phosphate-remover-diy-t16734.html

There are a couple members who run with a scrubber only. PRC and OhNoNemo for sure... and I believe there are a few others.

 

[BL1]

+1 Erin, I was just about to suggest that especially if you're trying to save money. I've been using one and love it, I'm in the process of building a second one now.

 

[fmjnax]

Thanks phastroh.

I like that scrubber idea Erin! Looks fairly simple. I'll read up on it a bit more. Maybe I will build both and run them on our test setup and see which one wins out. ;)