questions for all the brainy types!

Discussion in 'Reef Fishes' started by Melonbob, May 17, 2009.

  1. Melonbob

    Melonbob

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    I bought a used tank setup for my little store. Heres the scoop. It is 3 - 21G (36x12x12) tanks set up vertically on a steel rack, with a 22g sump at the bottom. So each tank is directly above the last, with the rim of the top tank at 6 feet. Each drain is 1", but opens into a common 1.5" drain to the sump. There is a single 3/4" return line, that reduces down to 1/2" loc-line that just hangs over the rim of each tank.

    What the hell do I need for a return pump? How much GPH? And I'm assuming the top tank would have less return pressure than the bottom due to head pressure, but I can adjust that with the ball valves

    So anyways, another question. The sump is an acrylic E.T.S.S. protean 400? Its nice looking, and has a built in skimmer. Anyone know anything about this? The pump for the skimmer is not included, but it recommends a mag 7. I'm going to use my quietone 2200 as I'm assuming its not enough for return.
     
    Melonbob, May 17, 2009
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  2. Melonbob

    ccCapt Reef Hacker Moderator

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    ccCapt, May 17, 2009
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  3. Melonbob

    Rcpilot

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    Can you post a pic of the setup?

    Sounds like it would be an awesome frag system. :bounce:

    A 1" line will drain MAX 600gph. If you have 3 drain lines (1 from each 21g tank) at 1" each, then you can POTENTIALLY drain a max of 1800gph into the sump. But that doesn't necessarily mean you want to move that much water. You could slow it way down and only move 300gph if you wanted too. The 1800gph is only the MAX your system can do.

    I'm going to cheat and make the math easy by saying each 36x12x12 tank is only 20g.

    With each of the 3 tank at 20g - let's say you wanted 20x turnover. You need 400GPH for each tank. x3 and you need a 1200gph pump. That doesn't mean it needs to pump 1200gph at 6 feet of head. It only needs to pump 400gph at 6 feet of head because you only have one tank that high. If it'll do 400gph at 6 feet and 800gph at 4 feet and 1200gph at 2 feet ....... that pump will do the job.

    Of course you can adjust those numbers if you only want 10x turnover in the tank. And use plenty of ball valves to adjust flow.

    Don't worry about pumping the tanks full of water and causing a flood. As long as you remember each 1" drain line can do 600gph and don't put more water IN the tank, then you will not experience a flood.

    I think............ :shock:
     
    Rcpilot, May 17, 2009
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  4. Melonbob

    RyanG ^*Eternal Dumbass*^

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    Bob could you re-do the plumbing so that you are only pumping water from the sump to the top tank and use overflows and gravity to have the water get to the second and third tanks? It would cut down on the flow in them but thats nothing a cheap powerhead couldnt handle and to me it sounds like a more simple set up. Just an option I thought that I would throw out.
     
    RyanG, May 17, 2009
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  5. Melonbob

    Rcpilot

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    Did you just openly suggest a powerhead in the tank for water circulation?

    Somebody get a rope!!!

    j/k :mrgreen: I think powerheads in the tank are ugly. My next tank will be drilled with a closed loop for circulation. You won't see anything but one or two 1" drain lines at the water surface.
     
    Rcpilot, May 17, 2009
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  6. Melonbob

    RyanG ^*Eternal Dumbass*^

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    RC have you had a closed loop yet? I will NEVER have a tank with one again, they are ineffecient and my isnt sufficient enough for sps. Powerheads are the only way to go IMO/IME.
     
    RyanG, May 18, 2009
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  7. Melonbob

    Alexander

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    Im with ryang. i really strongly dislike my closed loop setup
     
    Alexander, May 18, 2009
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  8. Melonbob

    cthegame

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    I'm also with Ryan on this one. nothing can compare to the actual source of water flow being in the tank. Yes its more ugly but well worth it...and one might say that the ugliness of a healthy system is actually not ugly at all but part of its overall beauty :)
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2009
    cthegame, May 18, 2009
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  9. Melonbob

    yote Ceritfied Mantis Hunter Moderator

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    With a little time and thought,you can hide any powerhead within the rock work to the point that you'll be the only one to know their there.
     
    yote, May 18, 2009
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  10. Melonbob

    dustin_P74

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    i dont think a powerhead being in the tank is really a concern here since this will be used to house corals until they sell
     
    dustin_P74, May 18, 2009
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  11. Melonbob

    Rcpilot

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    Really?

    Are you guys using underpowered pumps for your closed loop systems?

    I read a LOT on different websites and I came to the conclusion that the closed loop was the shizzle when it comes to water circulation........

    ?
    ?
    ?

    :shock:
     
    Rcpilot, May 18, 2009
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  12. Melonbob

    yote Ceritfied Mantis Hunter Moderator

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    One of the problems I can see with a closed loop,is if you go with a pump big enough to crank out say 1200gph out of 4 lines,its going to be pretty dang loud.
    Not really what I'd want to hear outta my tank while I'm trying to watch Ax Men or sleep.
     
    yote, May 19, 2009
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  13. Melonbob

    RyanG ^*Eternal Dumbass*^

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    In theory they are the bees knees but in function they come up lacking unless you have a lot of room a lot of pumps and a lot of money! My pump is probably a little undersized but not by a lot. I could use to go up one size, but even at its rating we are talking 20x turnover in my system. I can do that with two K4s, I could get it up to 40x turnover with four K4s and still have it come in less that the "upgraded pump" that would get me to 30x rate. Then you have the noise factor, extrenal pumps are LOUD all of them have a hum of some sort, mine is more like a mild roar! If you have a basement that you can keep a couple of pumps in and dont mind your electricity bill being $20-30 higher than closed loops can be made effective. But if you want to get truly random flow plan on getting a Oceans Motion for each pump and that will crank up your cost another 200+ for each pump. They all have their pros and cons looks are the only downfall that I can think of with powerheads.

    RC I absolutley HATE the look of powerheads BUT I think I hate the ineffectiveness of my closed loop more. I know that my next tank wont have a closed loop too much of a PITA for me.
     
    RyanG, May 19, 2009
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